How to stop torture - Karen Tse
[Music]
[Music]
[Music]
[Music]
[Applause]
in
in
in
1994<00:00:18.359> I<00:00:18.439> walked<00:00:18.720> into<00:00:18.920> a<00:00:19.039> prison<00:00:19.320> in<00:00:19.880> Cambodia
1994 I walked into a prison in Cambodia
1994 I walked into a prison in Cambodia
and<00:00:21.000> I<00:00:21.119> met<00:00:21.279> a<00:00:21.400> 12-year-old<00:00:22.039> boy<00:00:23.039> who<00:00:23.359> had<00:00:23.480> been
and I met a 12-year-old boy who had been
and I met a 12-year-old boy who had been
tortured<00:00:24.439> and<00:00:24.560> was<00:00:24.720> denied<00:00:25.160> access<00:00:25.439> to
tortured and was denied access to
tortured and was denied access to
council<00:00:27.119> and<00:00:27.240> as<00:00:27.359> I<00:00:27.480> looked<00:00:27.679> into<00:00:27.920> his<00:00:28.160> eyes<00:00:28.439> I
council and as I looked into his eyes I
council and as I looked into his eyes I
realized<00:00:29.119> that<00:00:29.240> for<00:00:29.400> the<00:00:29.640> hundred<00:00:30.080> of<00:00:30.199> letters
realized that for the hundred of letters
realized that for the hundred of letters
that<00:00:30.599> I<00:00:30.679> had<00:00:30.840> written<00:00:31.519> for<00:00:31.759> political
that I had written for political
that I had written for political
prisoners<00:00:33.480> that<00:00:33.680> I<00:00:33.760> would<00:00:34.000> never<00:00:34.280> have
prisoners that I would never have
prisoners that I would never have
written<00:00:34.640> a<00:00:34.760> letter<00:00:34.960> for<00:00:35.200> him<00:00:36.200> because<00:00:36.399> he<00:00:36.520> was
written a letter for him because he was
written a letter for him because he was
not<00:00:36.840> a<00:00:37.000> 12-year-old<00:00:37.680> boy<00:00:38.200> who<00:00:38.520> had<00:00:38.800> done
not a 12-year-old boy who had done
not a 12-year-old boy who had done
something<00:00:39.440> important<00:00:39.719> for<00:00:39.879> anybody<00:00:40.239> he<00:00:40.360> was
something important for anybody he was
something important for anybody he was
not<00:00:40.600> a<00:00:40.680> political<00:00:41.039> prisoner<00:00:41.960> he<00:00:42.079> was<00:00:42.239> a
not a political prisoner he was a
not a political prisoner he was a
12-year-old<00:00:43.039> boy<00:00:43.760> who<00:00:43.879> had<00:00:44.039> stolen<00:00:44.360> a
12-year-old boy who had stolen a
12-year-old boy who had stolen a
bicycle<00:00:46.640> what<00:00:46.760> I<00:00:46.879> also<00:00:47.120> realized<00:00:47.559> at<00:00:47.719> that
bicycle what I also realized at that
bicycle what I also realized at that
point<00:00:48.280> was<00:00:48.399> that<00:00:48.520> it<00:00:48.640> was<00:00:48.760> not<00:00:48.879> only<00:00:49.600> Cambodia
point was that it was not only Cambodia
point was that it was not only Cambodia
but<00:00:51.280> of<00:00:51.440> the<00:00:51.760> 113<00:00:52.760> developing<00:00:53.239> countries<00:00:53.559> at
but of the 113 developing countries at
but of the 113 developing countries at
torture<00:00:54.800> 93<00:00:55.440> of<00:00:55.559> these<00:00:55.760> countries<00:00:56.280> have<00:00:56.480> all
torture 93 of these countries have all
torture 93 of these countries have all
passed<00:00:57.120> laws<00:00:58.000> that<00:00:58.199> say<00:00:58.600> you<00:00:58.719> have<00:00:58.840> a<00:00:58.960> right<00:00:59.079> to
passed laws that say you have a right to
passed laws that say you have a right to
a<00:00:59.280> lawyer<00:01:00.039> and<00:01:00.160> you<00:01:00.399> right<00:01:00.559> not<00:01:00.719> to<00:01:00.800> be
a lawyer and you right not to be
a lawyer and you right not to be
tortured<00:01:02.280> and<00:01:02.399> what<00:01:02.519> I<00:01:02.680> recognized<00:01:03.320> was<00:01:03.480> that
tortured and what I recognized was that
tortured and what I recognized was that
there<00:01:03.680> was<00:01:03.800> an<00:01:03.960> incredible<00:01:04.680> window<00:01:05.080> of
there was an incredible window of
there was an incredible window of
opportunity<00:01:06.479> for<00:01:06.720> us<00:01:06.880> as<00:01:07.000> a<00:01:07.159> world<00:01:07.479> Community
opportunity for us as a world Community
opportunity for us as a world Community
to<00:01:08.159> come<00:01:08.600> together<00:01:09.600> and<00:01:09.799> end<00:01:10.040> torture<00:01:10.400> as<00:01:10.479> an
to come together and end torture as an
to come together and end torture as an
investigative<00:01:11.360> tool<00:01:12.360> we<00:01:12.520> often<00:01:12.759> think<00:01:13.000> of
investigative tool we often think of
investigative tool we often think of
torture<00:01:13.799> as<00:01:13.960> being<00:01:14.520> political<00:01:14.960> torture<00:01:15.840> or
torture as being political torture or
torture as being political torture or
reserved<00:01:16.759> for<00:01:17.280> just<00:01:17.520> the<00:01:17.680> worst<00:01:18.600> but<00:01:18.799> in<00:01:19.040> fact
reserved for just the worst but in fact
reserved for just the worst but in fact
95%<00:01:20.479> of<00:01:20.600> torture<00:01:20.920> today<00:01:21.680> is<00:01:21.880> not<00:01:22.079> for
95% of torture today is not for
95% of torture today is not for
political<00:01:22.640> prisoners<00:01:23.600> it<00:01:23.759> is<00:01:24.079> for<00:01:24.520> people<00:01:25.520> who
political prisoners it is for people who
political prisoners it is for people who
are<00:01:26.159> in<00:01:26.360> broken<00:01:26.799> down<00:01:26.960> legal<00:01:27.360> systems<00:01:28.360> and
are in broken down legal systems and
are in broken down legal systems and
unfortunately<00:01:29.240> because<00:01:29.600> tor<00:01:29.880> torture<00:01:30.200> is<00:01:30.360> the
unfortunately because tor torture is the
unfortunately because tor torture is the
cheapest<00:01:30.960> form<00:01:31.159> of<00:01:31.399> Investigation<00:01:32.399> it's
cheapest form of Investigation it's
cheapest form of Investigation it's
cheaper<00:01:32.840> than<00:01:33.000> having<00:01:33.200> a<00:01:33.320> legal<00:01:33.640> system
cheaper than having a legal system
cheaper than having a legal system
cheaper<00:01:34.320> than<00:01:34.479> having<00:01:34.640> a<00:01:34.759> lawyer<00:01:35.079> and<00:01:35.240> early
cheaper than having a lawyer and early
cheaper than having a lawyer and early
access<00:01:35.840> to<00:01:36.040> counsel<00:01:36.840> it<00:01:36.960> is<00:01:37.159> what<00:01:37.360> happens
access to counsel it is what happens
access to counsel it is what happens
most<00:01:38.119> of<00:01:38.280> the
most of the
most of the
time<00:01:40.040> I<00:01:40.200> believe<00:01:40.479> today<00:01:40.799> that<00:01:40.920> it<00:01:41.040> is<00:01:41.320> possible
time I believe today that it is possible
time I believe today that it is possible
for<00:01:41.880> us<00:01:42.040> as<00:01:42.159> a<00:01:42.280> world<00:01:42.600> Community<00:01:43.560> if<00:01:43.720> we<00:01:43.840> make<00:01:44.000> a
for us as a world Community if we make a
for us as a world Community if we make a
decision<00:01:44.799> to<00:01:45.000> come<00:01:45.360> together<00:01:45.960> and<00:01:46.200> end
decision to come together and end
decision to come together and end
torture<00:01:46.960> as<00:01:47.079> an<00:01:47.240> investigative<00:01:47.799> tool<00:01:48.159> in<00:01:48.280> our
torture as an investigative tool in our
torture as an investigative tool in our
lifetime<00:01:49.640> but<00:01:49.759> it<00:01:49.880> will<00:01:50.119> require<00:01:50.560> three
lifetime but it will require three
lifetime but it will require three
things<00:01:52.119> first<00:01:52.759> is<00:01:52.880> the<00:01:53.119> training<00:01:54.119> empowerment
things first is the training empowerment
things first is the training empowerment
and<00:01:54.840> connection<00:01:55.320> of<00:01:55.479> Defenders<00:01:56.399> worldwide
and connection of Defenders worldwide
and connection of Defenders worldwide
the<00:01:57.640> second<00:01:58.640> is<00:01:59.320> ensuring<00:02:00.000> that<00:02:00.119> there<00:02:00.240> is
the second is ensuring that there is
the second is ensuring that there is
systematic<00:02:01.200> Early<00:02:01.640> Access<00:02:01.920> to<00:02:02.439> councel<00:02:03.439> and
systematic Early Access to councel and
systematic Early Access to councel and
the<00:02:03.799> third<00:02:04.680> is
the third is
the third is
commitment<00:02:06.719> so<00:02:06.920> in<00:02:07.039> the<00:02:07.159> year
commitment so in the year
commitment so in the year
2000<00:02:09.239> I<00:02:09.360> began<00:02:09.920> to<00:02:11.280> wonder<00:02:12.280> what<00:02:12.599> if<00:02:13.040> we<00:02:13.239> came
2000 I began to wonder what if we came
2000 I began to wonder what if we came
together<00:02:14.280> could<00:02:14.440> we<00:02:14.640> do<00:02:14.879> something<00:02:15.519> for<00:02:15.879> these
together could we do something for these
together could we do something for these
93<00:02:17.000> countries<00:02:18.000> and<00:02:18.160> I<00:02:18.319> founded<00:02:18.720> International
93 countries and I founded International
93 countries and I founded International
bridet<00:02:19.560> of<00:02:19.800> Justice<00:02:20.800> which<00:02:20.959> has<00:02:21.080> a<00:02:21.280> specific
bridet of Justice which has a specific
bridet of Justice which has a specific
mission<00:02:22.560> of<00:02:22.760> ending<00:02:23.080> tortures<00:02:23.480> and
mission of ending tortures and
mission of ending tortures and
investigative<00:02:24.280> tool<00:02:25.280> and<00:02:26.120> implementing<00:02:26.640> due
investigative tool and implementing due
investigative tool and implementing due
process<00:02:27.319> rights<00:02:27.720> in<00:02:27.840> the<00:02:27.920> 93<00:02:28.519> countries<00:02:29.400> by
process rights in the 93 countries by
process rights in the 93 countries by
placing<00:02:30.040> ing<00:02:30.120> trained<00:02:30.480> lawyers<00:02:30.959> at<00:02:31.080> an<00:02:31.200> early
placing ing trained lawyers at an early
placing ing trained lawyers at an early
stage<00:02:32.040> in<00:02:32.200> police<00:02:32.480> stations<00:02:33.000> and<00:02:33.120> in
stage in police stations and in
stage in police stations and in
courtrooms<00:02:34.879> my<00:02:35.040> first<00:02:35.360> experiences<00:02:36.000> though
courtrooms my first experiences though
courtrooms my first experiences though
did<00:02:36.400> come<00:02:36.640> from<00:02:36.879> Cambodia<00:02:37.879> and<00:02:38.040> at<00:02:38.160> the<00:02:38.400> time<00:02:39.080> I
did come from Cambodia and at the time I
did come from Cambodia and at the time I
remember<00:02:39.519> first<00:02:39.760> coming<00:02:40.000> into<00:02:40.200> Cambodia<00:02:40.640> and
remember first coming into Cambodia and
remember first coming into Cambodia and
there<00:02:40.840> were<00:02:41.640> in<00:02:41.800> 1994<00:02:42.560> still<00:02:42.840> less<00:02:43.000> than<00:02:43.120> 10
there were in 1994 still less than 10
there were in 1994 still less than 10
attorneys<00:02:43.720> in<00:02:43.840> the<00:02:43.959> country<00:02:44.959> because<00:02:45.560> the
attorneys in the country because the
attorneys in the country because the
Comm<00:02:46.000> rou<00:02:46.239> had<00:02:46.360> killed<00:02:46.599> them<00:02:46.760> all<00:02:47.640> and<00:02:47.840> even<00:02:48.040> 20
Comm rou had killed them all and even 20
Comm rou had killed them all and even 20
years<00:02:48.480> later<00:02:48.720> there<00:02:48.800> was<00:02:48.920> only<00:02:49.080> 10<00:02:49.319> lawyers<00:02:49.640> in
years later there was only 10 lawyers in
years later there was only 10 lawyers in
the<00:02:49.840> country<00:02:50.159> so<00:02:50.400> consequently<00:02:50.879> you'd<00:02:51.080> walk
the country so consequently you'd walk
the country so consequently you'd walk
into<00:02:51.440> a<00:02:51.680> prison<00:02:52.680> and<00:02:53.120> um<00:02:53.680> Not<00:02:53.920> only<00:02:54.120> would<00:02:54.280> you
into a prison and um Not only would you
into a prison and um Not only would you
meet<00:02:54.599> 12-year-old<00:02:55.120> boys<00:02:55.400> you'd<00:02:55.599> meet<00:02:55.840> women
meet 12-year-old boys you'd meet women
meet 12-year-old boys you'd meet women
and<00:02:56.319> you'd<00:02:56.480> say<00:02:56.720> why<00:02:56.840> are<00:02:56.959> you<00:02:57.120> here<00:02:57.599> woman
and you'd say why are you here woman
and you'd say why are you here woman
would<00:02:57.959> say<00:02:58.200> well<00:02:58.360> I<00:02:58.440> was<00:02:58.680> I've<00:02:58.800> been<00:02:58.920> here<00:02:59.040> for
would say well I was I've been here for
would say well I was I've been here for
10<00:02:59.440> years<00:03:00.239> because<00:03:00.560> my<00:03:00.720> husband<00:03:01.040> committed<00:03:01.360> a
10 years because my husband committed a
10 years because my husband committed a
crime<00:03:01.840> but<00:03:02.159> they<00:03:02.319> can't<00:03:02.519> find<00:03:02.720> him<00:03:02.840> so<00:03:02.959> it<00:03:03.040> was
crime but they can't find him so it was
crime but they can't find him so it was
just<00:03:03.280> a<00:03:03.519> place<00:03:04.159> where<00:03:04.360> there<00:03:04.519> was<00:03:04.680> no<00:03:04.879> rule<00:03:05.080> of
just a place where there was no rule of
just a place where there was no rule of
law<00:03:06.159> the<00:03:06.280> first<00:03:06.519> group<00:03:06.680> of<00:03:06.799> Defenders<00:03:07.239> came
law the first group of Defenders came
law the first group of Defenders came
together<00:03:07.760> and<00:03:07.879> I<00:03:08.000> still<00:03:08.239> remember<00:03:09.239> um<00:03:09.599> as<00:03:09.720> I
together and I still remember um as I
together and I still remember um as I
was<00:03:09.959> training<00:03:10.360> I<00:03:10.440> said<00:03:10.680> okay<00:03:10.799> what<00:03:10.879> do<00:03:10.959> you<00:03:11.080> do
was training I said okay what do you do
was training I said okay what do you do
for<00:03:11.680> investigation<00:03:12.680> and<00:03:12.799> there<00:03:12.920> was<00:03:13.159> silence
for investigation and there was silence
for investigation and there was silence
in<00:03:13.720> the<00:03:13.879> class<00:03:14.120> and<00:03:14.319> finally<00:03:14.680> one<00:03:14.840> woman<00:03:15.080> stood
in the class and finally one woman stood
in the class and finally one woman stood
up<00:03:15.480> p<00:03:16.360> and<00:03:16.440> she<00:03:16.560> said<00:03:16.760> nekru<00:03:17.280> which<00:03:17.400> means<00:03:17.920> uh
up p and she said nekru which means uh
up p and she said nekru which means uh
teacher<00:03:19.120> she<00:03:19.319> said<00:03:19.760> I<00:03:19.920> have<00:03:20.239> defended<00:03:21.239> more
teacher she said I have defended more
teacher she said I have defended more
than<00:03:22.480> um<00:03:22.959> 100<00:03:23.360> people<00:03:24.360> and<00:03:24.799> I've<00:03:25.080> never<00:03:25.640> had<00:03:25.799> to
than um 100 people and I've never had to
than um 100 people and I've never had to
do<00:03:26.159> any<00:03:26.640> investigation<00:03:27.640> because<00:03:27.840> they<00:03:28.000> all
do any investigation because they all
do any investigation because they all
come<00:03:28.319> with<00:03:28.760> confessions<00:03:30.080> and<00:03:30.239> we<00:03:30.360> talked
come with confessions and we talked
come with confessions and we talked
about<00:03:31.360> as<00:03:31.480> a<00:03:31.720> class<00:03:32.480> the<00:03:32.680> fact<00:03:32.959> that<00:03:33.120> number
about as a class the fact that number
about as a class the fact that number
one<00:03:33.879> the<00:03:34.000> confessions<00:03:34.480> might<00:03:34.680> not<00:03:34.799> be
one the confessions might not be
one the confessions might not be
reliable<00:03:36.000> but<00:03:36.159> number<00:03:36.400> two<00:03:36.840> we<00:03:36.920> did<00:03:37.080> not<00:03:37.200> want
reliable but number two we did not want
reliable but number two we did not want
to<00:03:37.439> encourage<00:03:37.879> the<00:03:37.959> police<00:03:38.239> to<00:03:38.360> keep<00:03:38.519> doing
to encourage the police to keep doing
to encourage the police to keep doing
this<00:03:39.200> especially<00:03:39.680> as<00:03:39.799> it<00:03:39.879> was<00:03:40.040> now<00:03:40.280> against
this especially as it was now against
this especially as it was now against
the<00:03:40.640> law<00:03:41.640> and<00:03:41.760> it<00:03:41.879> took<00:03:42.040> a<00:03:42.120> lot<00:03:42.239> of<00:03:42.480> Courage<00:03:42.840> for
the law and it took a lot of Courage for
the law and it took a lot of Courage for
these<00:03:43.239> Defenders<00:03:43.720> to<00:03:43.959> decide<00:03:44.799> that<00:03:44.959> they
these Defenders to decide that they
these Defenders to decide that they
would<00:03:45.239> begin<00:03:45.480> to<00:03:45.760> stand<00:03:46.040> up<00:03:46.720> and<00:03:46.879> support<00:03:47.280> each
would begin to stand up and support each
would begin to stand up and support each
other<00:03:48.760> in<00:03:49.480> implementing<00:03:50.080> these<00:03:50.599> laws<00:03:51.599> and<00:03:51.720> I
other in implementing these laws and I
other in implementing these laws and I
still<00:03:52.000> remember<00:03:52.280> the<00:03:52.400> first<00:03:52.640> cases<00:03:52.959> where
still remember the first cases where
still remember the first cases where
they<00:03:53.280> came<00:03:53.560> all<00:03:53.959> 25<00:03:54.599> together<00:03:55.079> she<00:03:55.239> would
they came all 25 together she would
they came all 25 together she would
stand<00:03:55.599> up<00:03:55.760> and<00:03:55.840> they<00:03:55.920> were<00:03:56.040> in<00:03:56.120> the<00:03:56.280> back<00:03:56.959> and
stand up and they were in the back and
stand up and they were in the back and
they<00:03:57.159> would<00:03:57.319> support<00:03:57.680> her<00:03:58.040> and<00:03:58.159> the<00:03:58.280> judges
they would support her and the judges
they would support her and the judges
kept<00:03:58.879> saying<00:03:59.120> no<00:03:59.280> no<00:03:59.400> no<00:03:59.560> no<00:03:59.959> we're<00:04:00.079> going<00:04:00.159> to
kept saying no no no no we're going to
kept saying no no no no we're going to
do<00:04:00.480> things<00:04:01.480> the<00:04:01.640> exact<00:04:01.920> same<00:04:02.120> way<00:04:02.280> we've<00:04:02.439> been
do things the exact same way we've been
do things the exact same way we've been
doing<00:04:02.799> them<00:04:03.439> but<00:04:03.560> one<00:04:03.760> day<00:04:03.920> the<00:04:04.040> perfect<00:04:04.360> case
doing them but one day the perfect case
doing them but one day the perfect case
came<00:04:05.360> and<00:04:05.480> it<00:04:05.640> was<00:04:05.879> a<00:04:06.079> woman<00:04:06.319> who<00:04:06.439> was<00:04:06.519> a
came and it was a woman who was a
came and it was a woman who was a
vegetable<00:04:07.040> seller<00:04:07.560> she<00:04:07.799> was<00:04:08.079> sitting<00:04:08.400> outside
vegetable seller she was sitting outside
vegetable seller she was sitting outside
of<00:04:08.840> a<00:04:09.000> house<00:04:09.920> she<00:04:10.079> says<00:04:10.360> she<00:04:10.599> actually<00:04:10.840> saw<00:04:11.159> the
of a house she says she actually saw the
of a house she says she actually saw the
person<00:04:12.280> U<00:04:12.400> run<00:04:12.640> out<00:04:13.400> who<00:04:13.560> she<00:04:13.720> thinks<00:04:13.920> stole
person U run out who she thinks stole
person U run out who she thinks stole
whatever<00:04:14.760> the<00:04:14.879> jewelry<00:04:15.319> was<00:04:15.799> but<00:04:15.920> the<00:04:16.040> police
whatever the jewelry was but the police
whatever the jewelry was but the police
came<00:04:16.680> they<00:04:16.840> got<00:04:17.040> her<00:04:17.359> there<00:04:17.479> was<00:04:17.639> nothing<00:04:17.919> on
came they got her there was nothing on
came they got her there was nothing on
her<00:04:18.919> um<00:04:19.040> she<00:04:19.160> was<00:04:19.320> pregnant<00:04:19.680> at<00:04:19.799> the<00:04:19.959> time<00:04:20.320> she
her um she was pregnant at the time she
her um she was pregnant at the time she
had<00:04:20.680> cigarette<00:04:21.000> burns<00:04:21.320> on<00:04:21.519> her<00:04:21.799> she
had cigarette burns on her she
had cigarette burns on her she
miscarried<00:04:23.400> and<00:04:23.759> when<00:04:23.960> they<00:04:24.080> brought<00:04:24.320> her
miscarried and when they brought her
miscarried and when they brought her
case<00:04:24.800> to<00:04:24.960> the<00:04:25.080> judge<00:04:25.400> for<00:04:25.520> the<00:04:25.639> first<00:04:25.880> time<00:04:26.040> he
case to the judge for the first time he
case to the judge for the first time he
stood<00:04:26.360> up<00:04:26.479> and<00:04:26.560> he<00:04:26.680> said<00:04:27.000> yes<00:04:27.759> there's<00:04:28.040> no
stood up and he said yes there's no
stood up and he said yes there's no
evidence<00:04:29.000> except<00:04:29.240> for<00:04:29.320> your<00:04:29.440> torture
evidence except for your torture
evidence except for your torture
confession<00:04:31.039> and<00:04:31.160> you<00:04:31.280> will<00:04:31.400> be<00:04:31.560> released<00:04:32.440> and
confession and you will be released and
confession and you will be released and
the<00:04:32.840> Defenders<00:04:33.840> began<00:04:34.440> to<00:04:34.639> take<00:04:34.919> cases<00:04:35.400> over
the Defenders began to take cases over
the Defenders began to take cases over
and<00:04:35.759> over<00:04:36.039> again<00:04:36.919> and<00:04:37.280> you<00:04:37.440> will<00:04:37.680> see<00:04:37.960> they
and over again and you will see they
and over again and you will see they
have<00:04:38.600> step<00:04:38.919> by<00:04:39.120> step<00:04:39.400> began<00:04:40.160> to<00:04:40.360> change<00:04:40.840> the
have step by step began to change the
have step by step began to change the
course<00:04:41.199> of<00:04:41.400> history<00:04:42.160> in<00:04:42.400> Cambodia<00:04:43.240> but
course of history in Cambodia but
course of history in Cambodia but
Cambodia<00:04:44.000> is<00:04:44.199> not<00:04:44.400> alone<00:04:45.199> I<00:04:45.320> used<00:04:45.479> to<00:04:45.680> think
Cambodia is not alone I used to think
Cambodia is not alone I used to think
well<00:04:46.039> is<00:04:46.120> it<00:04:46.320> Cambodia<00:04:46.800> or<00:04:46.919> is<00:04:47.000> it<00:04:47.160> other
well is it Cambodia or is it other
well is it Cambodia or is it other
countries<00:04:48.199> but<00:04:48.520> it<00:04:48.800> is<00:04:49.639> in<00:04:49.880> so<00:04:50.080> many<00:04:50.360> countries
countries but it is in so many countries
countries but it is in so many countries
in<00:04:51.360> burndy<00:04:51.840> I<00:04:51.919> walked<00:04:52.160> into<00:04:52.320> a<00:04:52.440> prison<00:04:52.800> and<00:04:52.919> it
in burndy I walked into a prison and it
in burndy I walked into a prison and it
wasn't<00:04:53.560> a<00:04:54.080> um<00:04:54.680> wasn't<00:04:54.919> a<00:04:55.039> 12-year-old<00:04:55.520> boy<00:04:55.680> it
wasn't a um wasn't a 12-year-old boy it
wasn't a um wasn't a 12-year-old boy it
was<00:04:55.840> an<00:04:55.960> eight-year-old<00:04:56.479> boy<00:04:57.039> for<00:04:57.240> stealing<00:04:57.560> a
was an eight-year-old boy for stealing a
was an eight-year-old boy for stealing a
mobile<00:04:58.000> phone<00:04:58.520> or<00:04:58.720> a<00:04:58.880> woman<00:04:59.280> I<00:04:59.840> picked<00:05:00.080> up<00:05:00.199> her
mobile phone or a woman I picked up her
mobile phone or a woman I picked up her
baby<00:05:00.919> really<00:05:01.199> cute<00:05:01.440> baby<00:05:01.720> I<00:05:02.000> your<00:05:02.160> baby's<00:05:02.440> so
baby really cute baby I your baby's so
baby really cute baby I your baby's so
cute<00:05:03.160> wasn't<00:05:03.360> a<00:05:03.479> baby<00:05:03.680> she<00:05:03.800> was<00:05:03.960> three<00:05:04.680> and<00:05:04.800> she
cute wasn't a baby she was three and she
cute wasn't a baby she was three and she
said<00:05:05.240> yeah<00:05:05.400> but<00:05:05.520> she's<00:05:05.800> why<00:05:05.919> I'm<00:05:06.160> here<00:05:06.479> because
said yeah but she's why I'm here because
said yeah but she's why I'm here because
she<00:05:07.280> was<00:05:07.400> accused<00:05:07.759> of<00:05:07.880> stealing<00:05:08.199> two<00:05:08.520> diapers
she was accused of stealing two diapers
she was accused of stealing two diapers
and<00:05:09.680> an<00:05:09.880> iron<00:05:10.160> for<00:05:10.320> her<00:05:10.440> baby<00:05:10.680> and<00:05:10.840> still<00:05:11.039> had
and an iron for her baby and still had
and an iron for her baby and still had
been<00:05:11.440> in<00:05:11.639> in<00:05:11.840> prison<00:05:12.479> and<00:05:12.560> when<00:05:12.680> I<00:05:12.840> walked<00:05:13.160> up
been in in prison and when I walked up
been in in prison and when I walked up
to<00:05:13.720> the<00:05:14.400> prison<00:05:14.720> director<00:05:15.120> I<00:05:15.199> said<00:05:15.680> you<00:05:15.800> got<00:05:15.880> to
to the prison director I said you got to
to the prison director I said you got to
let<00:05:16.160> her<00:05:16.320> out<00:05:17.080> a<00:05:17.240> judge<00:05:17.440> would<00:05:17.639> let<00:05:17.759> her<00:05:17.919> out
let her out a judge would let her out
let her out a judge would let her out
and<00:05:18.560> he<00:05:18.680> said<00:05:19.039> okay<00:05:19.600> we<00:05:19.720> can<00:05:19.880> talk<00:05:20.120> about<00:05:20.319> it
and he said okay we can talk about it
and he said okay we can talk about it
but<00:05:20.720> look<00:05:20.840> at<00:05:20.960> my<00:05:21.199> prison
but look at my prison
but look at my prison
80%<00:05:23.840> of<00:05:23.960> the<00:05:24.120> 2,000<00:05:24.680> people<00:05:25.039> here<00:05:25.680> are<00:05:25.919> without
80% of the 2,000 people here are without
80% of the 2,000 people here are without
a<00:05:26.240> lawyer<00:05:26.960> what<00:05:27.120> can<00:05:27.280> we<00:05:27.479> do<00:05:28.160> so<00:05:28.360> lawyers<00:05:28.720> began
a lawyer what can we do so lawyers began
a lawyer what can we do so lawyers began
to<00:05:29.120> Courageous<00:05:30.120> stand<00:05:30.400> up<00:05:30.759> together<00:05:31.400> to
to Courageous stand up together to
to Courageous stand up together to
organize<00:05:32.039> a<00:05:32.199> system<00:05:32.800> where<00:05:33.080> they<00:05:33.199> can<00:05:33.400> take
organize a system where they can take
organize a system where they can take
cases<00:05:34.479> but<00:05:34.600> we<00:05:34.759> realize<00:05:35.080> that<00:05:35.199> it's<00:05:35.360> not<00:05:35.560> only
cases but we realize that it's not only
cases but we realize that it's not only
the<00:05:36.000> training<00:05:36.319> of<00:05:36.440> the<00:05:36.560> lawyers<00:05:37.360> but<00:05:37.479> the
the training of the lawyers but the
the training of the lawyers but the
connection<00:05:38.280> of<00:05:38.400> the<00:05:38.520> lawyers<00:05:39.199> that<00:05:39.360> makes<00:05:39.560> a
connection of the lawyers that makes a
connection of the lawyers that makes a
difference<00:05:40.120> for<00:05:40.360> example<00:05:40.680> in<00:05:40.919> Cambodia<00:05:41.919> it
difference for example in Cambodia it
difference for example in Cambodia it
was<00:05:42.440> that<00:05:43.000> pong<00:05:43.600> did<00:05:43.720> not<00:05:43.880> go<00:05:44.039> alone<00:05:44.560> but<00:05:44.680> she
was that pong did not go alone but she
was that pong did not go alone but she
had<00:05:45.080> 24<00:05:45.680> lawyers<00:05:46.080> with<00:05:46.240> her<00:05:46.680> who<00:05:46.840> stood<00:05:47.120> up
had 24 lawyers with her who stood up
had 24 lawyers with her who stood up
together<00:05:48.319> and<00:05:48.560> in<00:05:48.680> the<00:05:48.800> same<00:05:49.039> way<00:05:49.199> in<00:05:49.319> China
together and in the same way in China
together and in the same way in China
they<00:05:49.880> always<00:05:50.080> tell<00:05:50.280> me<00:05:50.720> it's<00:05:50.919> like<00:05:51.039> a<00:05:51.199> fresh
they always tell me it's like a fresh
they always tell me it's like a fresh
wind<00:05:51.720> in<00:05:51.840> the<00:05:51.960> desert<00:05:52.360> when<00:05:52.520> we<00:05:52.639> can<00:05:52.800> come
wind in the desert when we can come
wind in the desert when we can come
together<00:05:54.000> or<00:05:54.319> in<00:05:54.560> Zimbabwe<00:05:55.280> where<00:05:55.400> I<00:05:55.520> remember
together or in Zimbabwe where I remember
together or in Zimbabwe where I remember
innocent<00:05:57.000> after<00:05:57.240> coming<00:05:57.479> out<00:05:57.600> of<00:05:57.680> a<00:05:57.840> prison
innocent after coming out of a prison
innocent after coming out of a prison
where<00:05:58.759> everybody<00:05:59.120> stood<00:05:59.400> up<00:05:59.520> in<00:05:59.639> and<00:05:59.759> said
where everybody stood up in and said
where everybody stood up in and said
I've<00:06:00.080> been<00:06:00.199> here<00:06:00.319> for<00:06:00.520> 1<00:06:00.720> year<00:06:01.000> 8<00:06:01.280> year<00:06:01.560> 12
I've been here for 1 year 8 year 12
I've been here for 1 year 8 year 12
years<00:06:02.600> without<00:06:02.840> a<00:06:02.960> lawyer<00:06:03.680> he<00:06:03.919> came<00:06:04.600> and<00:06:04.720> we
years without a lawyer he came and we
years without a lawyer he came and we
had<00:06:04.919> a<00:06:05.039> training<00:06:05.560> together<00:06:06.360> and<00:06:06.520> he<00:06:07.080> said<00:06:08.080> I
had a training together and he said I
had a training together and he said I
have<00:06:08.360> heard<00:06:08.560> it<00:06:08.759> said<00:06:09.080> because<00:06:09.280> he<00:06:09.400> had<00:06:09.520> heard
have heard it said because he had heard
have heard it said because he had heard
people<00:06:09.960> mumbling<00:06:10.479> and<00:06:10.599> grumbling<00:06:11.599> I<00:06:11.720> have
people mumbling and grumbling I have
people mumbling and grumbling I have
heard<00:06:12.080> it<00:06:12.319> said<00:06:13.280> that<00:06:14.199> we<00:06:14.759> cannot<00:06:15.759> help<00:06:16.160> to
heard it said that we cannot help to
heard it said that we cannot help to
create<00:06:16.720> Justice<00:06:17.639> because<00:06:17.880> we<00:06:18.000> do<00:06:18.120> not<00:06:18.280> have
create Justice because we do not have
create Justice because we do not have
the<00:06:18.720> resources<00:06:19.720> and<00:06:19.880> then<00:06:20.039> he<00:06:20.199> said<00:06:20.720> but<00:06:20.880> I
the resources and then he said but I
the resources and then he said but I
want<00:06:21.120> you<00:06:21.240> to<00:06:21.440> know<00:06:22.120> that<00:06:22.280> the<00:06:22.479> lack<00:06:22.639> of
want you to know that the lack of
want you to know that the lack of
resources<00:06:23.800> is<00:06:24.039> never<00:06:24.319> an<00:06:24.520> excuse<00:06:24.880> for
resources is never an excuse for
resources is never an excuse for
Injustice<00:06:26.280> and<00:06:26.520> with<00:06:26.840> that<00:06:27.520> he<00:06:27.800> successfully
Injustice and with that he successfully
Injustice and with that he successfully
organized<00:06:29.039> 68<00:06:29.599> lawyers<00:06:30.319> who've<00:06:30.599> been
organized 68 lawyers who've been
organized 68 lawyers who've been
systematically<00:06:31.520> taking<00:06:31.800> the<00:06:31.960> cases<00:06:32.759> the<00:06:32.960> key
systematically taking the cases the key
systematically taking the cases the key
that<00:06:33.400> we<00:06:33.560> see<00:06:34.000> though<00:06:34.599> is<00:06:35.000> training<00:06:36.000> and<00:06:36.120> then
that we see though is training and then
that we see though is training and then
Early<00:06:36.800> Access<00:06:37.199> I<00:06:37.280> was<00:06:37.440> recently<00:06:37.880> in<00:06:38.080> Egypt<00:06:39.039> and
Early Access I was recently in Egypt and
Early Access I was recently in Egypt and
was<00:06:39.599> inspired<00:06:40.039> to<00:06:40.160> meet<00:06:40.360> with<00:06:40.520> another<00:06:40.840> group
was inspired to meet with another group
was inspired to meet with another group
of<00:06:41.120> lawyers<00:06:41.919> and<00:06:42.039> what<00:06:42.199> they<00:06:42.319> told<00:06:42.520> me<00:06:42.680> is<00:06:42.800> they
of lawyers and what they told me is they
of lawyers and what they told me is they
said<00:06:43.199> hey<00:06:43.440> look<00:06:44.160> we<00:06:44.280> don't<00:06:44.560> have<00:06:44.840> police<00:06:45.120> on
said hey look we don't have police on
said hey look we don't have police on
the<00:06:45.360> streets<00:06:45.759> now<00:06:46.240> the<00:06:46.400> police<00:06:46.680> are<00:06:46.880> one<00:06:47.000> of
the streets now the police are one of
the streets now the police are one of
the<00:06:47.280> main<00:06:47.560> reasons<00:06:48.000> why<00:06:48.120> we<00:06:48.240> had<00:06:48.360> the
the main reasons why we had the
the main reasons why we had the
revolution<00:06:48.960> they<00:06:49.039> were<00:06:49.240> torturing<00:06:49.840> everybody
revolution they were torturing everybody
revolution they were torturing everybody
all<00:06:50.639> the<00:06:51.240> time<00:06:52.240> and<00:06:52.319> I<00:06:52.440> said<00:06:52.680> but<00:06:52.800> you<00:06:53.000> there's
all the time and I said but you there's
all the time and I said but you there's
been<00:06:53.599> tens<00:06:54.000> of<00:06:54.240> millions<00:06:54.639> of<00:06:54.960> dollars<00:06:55.759> that
been tens of millions of dollars that
been tens of millions of dollars that
has<00:06:56.160> got<00:06:56.360> that<00:06:56.440> have<00:06:56.680> G<00:06:56.840> that<00:06:57.000> has<00:06:57.240> recently
has got that have G that has recently
has got that have G that has recently
gone<00:06:58.000> in<00:06:58.479> to<00:06:58.680> the<00:06:58.759> development<00:06:59.120> of<00:06:59.199> the<00:06:59.280> legal
gone in to the development of the legal
gone in to the development of the legal
system<00:07:00.160> here<00:07:00.800> what's<00:07:01.080> going<00:07:01.280> on<00:07:01.680> I<00:07:01.759> met<00:07:02.039> with
system here what's going on I met with
system here what's going on I met with
one<00:07:02.479> of<00:07:02.720> the<00:07:03.039> um<00:07:03.199> development<00:07:04.039> agencies<00:07:05.039> and
one of the um development agencies and
one of the um development agencies and
they<00:07:05.479> were<00:07:05.639> training<00:07:06.080> prosecutors<00:07:07.039> and
they were training prosecutors and
they were training prosecutors and
judges<00:07:07.759> which<00:07:07.879> is<00:07:08.000> a<00:07:08.199> normal<00:07:08.560> bias<00:07:09.080> as<00:07:09.199> opposed
judges which is a normal bias as opposed
judges which is a normal bias as opposed
to<00:07:09.800> Defenders<00:07:10.800> and<00:07:10.960> they<00:07:11.080> showed<00:07:11.360> me<00:07:11.520> a<00:07:11.639> manual
to Defenders and they showed me a manual
to Defenders and they showed me a manual
which<00:07:12.400> actually<00:07:12.639> was<00:07:12.800> an<00:07:13.080> excellent<00:07:13.479> manual<00:07:13.800> I
which actually was an excellent manual I
which actually was an excellent manual I
said<00:07:14.039> I'm<00:07:14.120> going<00:07:14.240> to<00:07:14.400> copy<00:07:14.680> this<00:07:15.280> it<00:07:15.400> had
said I'm going to copy this it had
said I'm going to copy this it had
everything<00:07:16.000> in<00:07:16.160> it<00:07:16.800> lawyers<00:07:17.240> can<00:07:17.440> come<00:07:17.639> at<00:07:17.759> the
everything in it lawyers can come at the
everything in it lawyers can come at the
police<00:07:18.199> station<00:07:18.599> it<00:07:18.720> was<00:07:18.919> perfect
police station it was perfect
police station it was perfect
prosecutors<00:07:20.039> were<00:07:20.199> perfectly<00:07:20.520> trained<00:07:21.240> but<00:07:21.400> I
prosecutors were perfectly trained but I
prosecutors were perfectly trained but I
said<00:07:22.039> to<00:07:22.240> them<00:07:22.440> I<00:07:22.560> just<00:07:22.720> have<00:07:22.879> one<00:07:23.120> question
said to them I just have one question
said to them I just have one question
which<00:07:24.120> is<00:07:24.720> by<00:07:24.879> the<00:07:25.039> time<00:07:25.240> that<00:07:25.440> everybody<00:07:25.840> got
which is by the time that everybody got
which is by the time that everybody got
to<00:07:26.120> the<00:07:26.240> prosecutor's<00:07:26.879> office<00:07:27.720> what<00:07:27.879> had
to the prosecutor's office what had
to the prosecutor's office what had
happened<00:07:28.319> to<00:07:28.520> them<00:07:29.280> and<00:07:29.599> after<00:07:29.759> a<00:07:29.919> pause<00:07:30.319> they
happened to them and after a pause they
happened to them and after a pause they
said<00:07:31.319> they<00:07:31.479> had<00:07:31.599> been<00:07:32.199> tortured<00:07:33.199> so<00:07:33.360> the
said they had been tortured so the
said they had been tortured so the
pieces<00:07:33.840> are<00:07:34.319> not<00:07:34.479> only<00:07:34.680> the<00:07:34.800> training<00:07:35.039> of<00:07:35.120> the
pieces are not only the training of the
pieces are not only the training of the
lawyers<00:07:35.840> but<00:07:36.360> us<00:07:36.759> finding<00:07:37.080> a<00:07:37.240> way<00:07:37.919> to
lawyers but us finding a way to
lawyers but us finding a way to
systematically<00:07:39.800> implement<00:07:40.720> Early<00:07:41.199> Access<00:07:41.479> to
systematically implement Early Access to
systematically implement Early Access to
council<00:07:42.479> because<00:07:42.759> they<00:07:42.840> are<00:07:43.000> the<00:07:43.160> Safeguard
council because they are the Safeguard
council because they are the Safeguard
in<00:07:43.840> the<00:07:44.039> system<00:07:44.919> for<00:07:45.159> people<00:07:45.479> who<00:07:45.560> are<00:07:45.680> being
in the system for people who are being
in the system for people who are being
tortured<00:07:47.280> and<00:07:47.560> as<00:07:47.720> I<00:07:47.879> tell<00:07:48.080> you<00:07:48.240> this<00:07:48.440> I'm<00:07:48.599> also
tortured and as I tell you this I'm also
tortured and as I tell you this I'm also
aware<00:07:49.120> of<00:07:49.280> the<00:07:49.440> fact<00:07:49.720> that<00:07:50.280> it<00:07:50.440> sounds<00:07:50.759> like<00:07:51.000> oh
aware of the fact that it sounds like oh
aware of the fact that it sounds like oh
okay<00:07:51.639> it<00:07:51.800> sounds<00:07:52.199> like<00:07:52.879> we<00:07:53.000> could<00:07:53.199> do<00:07:53.319> it<00:07:53.560> but
okay it sounds like we could do it but
okay it sounds like we could do it but
can<00:07:53.840> we<00:07:54.000> really<00:07:54.159> do<00:07:54.280> it<00:07:54.440> because<00:07:54.560> it<00:07:54.680> sounds
can we really do it because it sounds
can we really do it because it sounds
big<00:07:56.440> and<00:07:57.120> there<00:07:57.240> are<00:07:57.400> many<00:07:57.680> reasons<00:07:58.039> why<00:07:58.159> I
big and there are many reasons why I
big and there are many reasons why I
believe<00:07:58.479> it's<00:07:58.720> possible<00:07:59.680> the<00:07:59.840> first<00:08:00.159> reason
believe it's possible the first reason
believe it's possible the first reason
is<00:08:01.440> the<00:08:01.680> people<00:08:02.319> on<00:08:02.520> the<00:08:02.720> ground<00:08:03.680> who<00:08:04.319> find
is the people on the ground who find
is the people on the ground who find
ways<00:08:05.319> of<00:08:05.520> creating<00:08:05.960> Miracles<00:08:06.520> because<00:08:06.720> of
ways of creating Miracles because of
ways of creating Miracles because of
their<00:08:07.000> commitment<00:08:08.000> it's<00:08:08.199> not<00:08:08.360> only<00:08:08.680> innocent
their commitment it's not only innocent
their commitment it's not only innocent
who<00:08:09.440> I<00:08:09.520> told<00:08:09.720> you<00:08:09.840> about<00:08:10.159> in<00:08:10.560> in<00:08:11.000> Zimbabwe<00:08:12.000> but
who I told you about in in Zimbabwe but
who I told you about in in Zimbabwe but
Defenders<00:08:13.360> all<00:08:13.599> over<00:08:13.919> the<00:08:14.080> world<00:08:14.759> who<00:08:14.879> are
Defenders all over the world who are
Defenders all over the world who are
looking<00:08:15.599> for<00:08:15.840> these<00:08:16.039> pieces<00:08:17.000> we<00:08:17.120> have<00:08:17.240> a
looking for these pieces we have a
looking for these pieces we have a
program<00:08:18.000> called<00:08:18.240> Justice<00:08:18.680> Bakers<00:08:19.680> and<00:08:19.800> we
program called Justice Bakers and we
program called Justice Bakers and we
realize<00:08:20.319> there<00:08:20.440> are<00:08:20.599> people<00:08:20.840> that<00:08:20.960> are
realize there are people that are
realize there are people that are
courageous<00:08:21.720> and<00:08:21.840> want<00:08:22.000> to<00:08:22.159> do<00:08:22.400> things<00:08:22.960> but<00:08:23.240> how
courageous and want to do things but how
courageous and want to do things but how
can<00:08:23.639> we<00:08:23.759> support<00:08:24.120> them<00:08:24.919> so<00:08:25.159> it's<00:08:25.280> an<00:08:25.479> online
can we support them so it's an online
can we support them so it's an online
contest<00:08:26.319> where<00:08:26.400> it's<00:08:26.560> only<00:08:26.919> $5,000<00:08:27.919> if<00:08:28.000> you
contest where it's only $5,000 if you
contest where it's only $5,000 if you
come<00:08:28.319> up<00:08:28.520> with<00:08:28.639> an<00:08:28.840> innovative<00:08:29.599> way<00:08:30.080> of
come up with an innovative way of
come up with an innovative way of
implementing<00:08:30.879> Justice<00:08:31.879> and<00:08:32.000> there<00:08:32.080> are<00:08:32.279> 30
implementing Justice and there are 30
implementing Justice and there are 30
Justice<00:08:32.959> makers<00:08:33.320> throughout<00:08:33.640> the<00:08:33.760> world<00:08:34.399> from
Justice makers throughout the world from
Justice makers throughout the world from
Sri<00:08:34.919> Lanka<00:08:35.519> to<00:08:36.279> swasiland<00:08:36.959> to<00:08:37.479> the<00:08:37.800> DRC<00:08:38.800> who
Sri Lanka to swasiland to the DRC who
Sri Lanka to swasiland to the DRC who
with
with
with
$5,000<00:08:40.880> do<00:08:41.200> amazing<00:08:41.680> things<00:08:42.240> through<00:08:42.479> SMS
$5,000 do amazing things through SMS
$5,000 do amazing things through SMS
programs<00:08:43.839> through<00:08:44.240> paral
Karen Tse, social, justice, socaial, activisism, torture, legal, system, TED, TED-Ed, TED, Ed, TEDEducation
